As already said, check the various web resources on prices paid for similar cars. Have you taken position that while you like the car you really don't care if you buy the car or not? If the dealer thinks you're already an owner in your mind they won't budge. When you make a counter offer stick with the trade value they offered and only negotiate a lower price for the car. Since they already said what your trade is worth the only remaining negotiation is what you are willing to pay for their car. Keep it limited to the only that aspect and you can get a better deal. I've posted in other threads about how I got my new 18 Abarth Spider for 10k under sticker using that "You need to sell the car far more than I want to own it" mind set. Where are you located? Good luck.