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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Guys,

Important: the tune would be on EU Abarth 124 Spider with Record Monza.

In EU I'm thinking about the best possible alternative.

Those who have the Tork Stage 1 are very satisfied when (if) it works. From what I have seen even more as EC Stage 1. So I have the option to pick Tork or EC and import it to EU. (+20% import TAX and + shipping)

or

I can go to a local tuner with good reputation. He promises +10kw and +48Nm. Which is the same as he would do it on normal Fiat 124, not the Abarth version. Price is 440€.


I think as almost eveyrone he is getting the tune from EU wholesaler and makes a measurement before/after. It's not a "custom" tune. Price 440€.

The questions:

1 - Isn't it possible to SAFELY make more power on Abarth compared to Fiat?

2 - We don't really have here the option to upgrade intercooler (or at least haven't seen it) and when it comes to intake the G-Tech Airpipe 300€ and Madness MaxFlow (390 €) is the only option. (third option would be Madness silicone air sleeve red - not sure how it compares to G-Tech/MaxFlow) So not really thinking about Stage 2 as I'm not sure where to source a better intercooler and also the intake seems pretty expensive. I would love to have Stage 2, but not sure how to. If there are EU members here would appreciate the help.

3 - Would you go to the local tuner even if it's not a custom tune or Tork Stage 1 imported? The +10kw doesn't seem a lot, I would guess Tork Stage 1 probably produces more without needing to go Stage 2.

If I would go Stage 2, I would probably take EC Stage 2, but then I would need to source parts.

4 - Is there a big difference between Stage 1 or Stage 2?

I would use the car 100% on road, no track. Maybe once every two years would go just to try and test the grip. But car would be daily driver mainly.
 

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I would go to a local tuner if you are located in the EU Area, but 10kw seems a little low
see if you can find something with in a good range, since EU is pretty small. Lots of good tuners
out there, take a trip.

I have Tork, Never tried EC but after some research EC's tune does not fit my need
I have the beta version for the Tork Tune Stage 1.5 (Not released) Previously, now I run on E85 Tune

But even on the stage 1.5 I would say it is superb, and by a lot of people's feedback, the Tork's tune is
better

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Also to other questions:
1. There is no difference drivetrain on the 124 between normal and the abarth version.

2. Intercooler upgrade is a must, OR else your intake temp is just going up

IMO Tork has the better tune, you won't regret it, but John is a little bit packed right now it took him about a week for him to get back to me on the revised tune for E85
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks @klikai. In EU we have some options for intakes: Madnass MaxFlow, G-Tech Airpipe, Madness silicone air sleeve. Forgot to mention afe intake - 500€.

Interclooer I have just found one - afe intercooler - 1500€. Way too much.

"Intercooler upgrade is a must " - I always thought it's rather nice to have, but not a must.

There is one good tuner 600km from me. Looks like my best bet would be to go to him.

Still not sure about the intake/intercooler upgrade :unsure:

edit: I see you have AFE intercooler. How are you satisfied? Have you previously tried something else?
 

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Autoricambi sells an intercooler for less than 800 bucks. Tork has the best tunes but they are busier so if you are patient and want the best that’s the way to go.

Stage 2 is not really needed for public roads
 

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Discussion Starter #6
hi Mini. Thanks for chiming in. I know in US you have some great prices on intercooler. The problem to import it to EUyou have to count few hundred for shipping and then approx 25% import fees (TAX and Customs). That's why it would be great to find and intercooler on this side :)
 

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Thanks @klikai. In EU we have some options for intakes: Madnass MaxFlow, G-Tech Airpipe, Madness silicone air sleeve. Forgot to mention afe intake - 500€.

Interclooer I have just found one - afe intercooler - 1500€. Way too much.

"Intercooler upgrade is a must " - I always thought it's rather nice to have, but not a must.

There is one good tuner 600km from me. Looks like my best bet would be to go to him.

Still not sure about the intake/intercooler upgrade :unsure:

edit: I see you have AFE intercooler. How are you satisfied? Have you previously tried something else?
Hey

I have the Tork Intercooler, I have an "AFE Intake"
Intake IMO I don't think its an airflow restriction, its just easier for me to do the oil change and looks cooler.
When I say intercooler is a must is that if you pushing it hard for a bit with an agreesive tune , then the OEM intercooler is not enough to hold the Intake air temp down. EC's intercooler is about $800 with piping, Tork is about $600 IIRC, AFE intercooler is massive looks decent but as you said the price is too much.

600km is nothing to get a good tune IMO.

In EU,

Skarra73 n Germany is good, Multiair Tuning and Development in Greece is also very decent
IIRC there are several in Germany and UK as well
 

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Now I have an US abarth (Pretty much the same, no record monza)
I have exhaust, intake, downpipe, and an intercooler
On the Stage 1.5 from tork I was making 193WHP peak and 175WHP at redline on a dynojet
Not bad on stock turbo and I have posted dyno graphs before, Check out my posts
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks @klikai. In that case I would definitely travel that distance to get the best possible tune. I know GarchingS54 did a tune in Germany (would go to the same tuner). Because of Marc's (GarchingS54) enormous knowledge with 124 platform I tried to get in connection with him, but he isn't the most communicative :)

There was a dynoday in Germany where they measured all possible Fiat/Abarth Spiders. The results were pretty consistent. This was also done by Marc. The cars was mostly tuned if I understood correctly by Reichert - German tuner with few exceptions.


It looks like the Reichert can get to around 190PS with Tune + Intake (G-tech Airpipe) + Pipercross air filter. As the intercooler is so expensive in EU I think none of the cars had it.

My car works great. Is new - 1200km on it. Don't really know, if I want to mess with changing the intercooler (costs a lot) opposed to just putting there an intake + air filter + tune. I would imagine intercooler would allow a little higher gains, but not sure it's worth it.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
A lot of people also say that the exhaust is a restriction and for Fiat in US ordering Good Win and also different exhausts. Not sure about the restriction of Record Monza. How it compares to the good US exhausts. For example have no idea if downpipe would give some gains and if it can even fit the Record Monza without modification.
 

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hi Mini. Thanks for chiming in. I know in US you have some great prices on intercooler. The problem to import it to EUyou have to count few hundred for shipping and then approx 25% import fees (TAX and Customs). That's why it would be great to find and intercooler on this side :)
25% import tax?! Wow lol.

But look on the bright side, you don’t really need it. UK is cold and Stage 1 should be plenty for you.
 

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A lot of people also say that the exhaust is a restriction and for Fiat in US ordering Good Win and also different exhausts. Not sure about the restriction of Record Monza. How it compares to the good US exhausts. For example have no idea if downpipe would give some gains and if it can even fit the Record Monza without modification.
Downpipe is a good upgrade but requires a tune to go with it. The Monza is the same size as stock as same limiting but again, it is not a big deal.
 

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In my experience EC Phase 1 barely adds any power. EC Phase 2 with intercooler and intake is roughly equivalent to Tork Stage 1 without any hardware modification.
 

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Dyno results show my EC P1/P2 almost identical except a few hundred RPMs right in the middle where the P2 is better. P2 made slightly more peak power and torque than my Tork Stage 1 tune but the Tork tune made more power to redline. I have a new Tork Stage 1 tune that I haven't dynoed yet. It's good but not substantially or obviously better than the other tunes. The original dyno of the first Tork tune was a completely stock car. After that the car was modified with a turbo back exhaust, EC FMIC, EC V4 intake and Forge components. I can't say definitively that the exhaust, intercooler and intake added much to the equation (power-wise) for the additional $3000 spent. I'm sure there is some benefit but I wouldn't value the improvement at $3000.

It seems to me the biggest single bang for your buck with this car is an E85 tune. If I could get E85 I would have already done this.
 

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If you want an uprated intercooler kit (with one piece hoses) sourced from the EU, search for "Scara73 124 intercooler" I have the "base" version which I modified for RHD, but LHD will be a direct fit. More details on an older thread that I posted, I will try to find it...
 

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Discussion Starter #16
@azzura thanks a lot! I haven't seen this one before. Really appreciate your suggestion. Already have searched for it. Looks like a nice piece. The price isn't on the website, so will contact him. Not really sure what RHD and LHD means. Guess something Right or Left.
 

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RHD = right hand drive = where the driver sits in the car = countries like the UK, Australia, India, Japan, South Africa, etc.

Prices from a few months ago, plus dimensions, are in this post https://www.124spider.org/threads/polling-for-interest-group-buy-on-uprated-intercooler-from-italy.33152/#post-490440

@jozefges I guess you are in mainland Europe, so you will be LHD = left hand drive.

Both the Eurocompulsion and Scara73 intercooler outlet hoses duck out to the side to avoid the alternator, so the modification for RHD is to cut that kink out of the hose and insert a long 45 degree pipe elbow that passes under the alternator.
 

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(the "duck out to the side" makes for an easier route around the alternator but the RHD steering column is in the way, hence the modification required for RHD)
 

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Discussion Starter #19
One more question - would I feel the difference between tuned stage 1 (stock parts) - 190PS and stock (Abarth stock 170PS/HP)? Does the 20PS/HP really make a difference?

As I see it it's a great upgrade for Fiat 124, because it would be more like +40-50PS/HP, but not sure about 170PS/HP vs 190PS/HP for EU Abarth. Your opinion?
 

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One more question - would I feel the difference between tuned stage 1 (stock parts) - 190PS and stock (Abarth stock 170PS/HP)? Does the 20PS/HP really make a difference?

As I see it it's a great upgrade for Fiat 124, because it would be more like +40-50PS/HP, but not sure about 170PS/HP vs 190PS/HP for EU Abarth. Your opinion?
Obviously you feel it but it is just a 15% power boost. It makes the car and engine feel healthy and quick. This is a momentum car, it is a 1.4T lmao
 
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