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Both Tork Motorsports and Eurocompulsion offer OBDII flash tuning systems that seem very similar. Tork's is $50 cheaper, which wouldn't be important if there was any reason to favor the Eurocompulsion's tuner.

I'm running pure stock and would only want to add a better tune. I don't want to add other mods, which makes Euro's Phase 2 irrelevant to me, inasmuch as you need to make additional mods to accommodate its extra power. Tork says that its Stage 1 tune adds 40 hp and 50 lbs of torque with no need for additional mods. That seems equivalent to Euro's Phase 1 addition.

Is there any distinction between these two flash tuners? Any reason to prefer one over the other?
 

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Both Tork Motorsports and Eurocompulsion offer OBDII flash tuning systems that seem very similar. Tork's is $50 cheaper, which wouldn't be important if there was any reason to favor the Eurocompulsion's tuner.

I'm running pure stock and would only want to add a better tune. I don't want to add other mods, which makes Euro's Phase 2 irrelevant to me, inasmuch as you need to make additional mods to accommodate its extra power. Tork says that its Stage 1 tune adds 40 hp and 50 lbs of torque with no need for additional mods. That seems equivalent to Euro's Phase 1 addition.

Is there any distinction between these two flash tuners? Any reason to prefer one over the other?

All things being equal I would have to say customer support would be very important to me,. I can't speak for Tork as I haven't dealt with them, but Eurocompulsion has been great at all times. I have both PI and P2 and they work well, and any issue I have had has been resolved quickly. In my case the few issues I had were operator induced and not their fault.
 

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To be fair, EC's dyno chart shows a 42.3whp gain while Tork's shows a 36.5whp gain, both on "Phase 1."

I'm not tuned by either yet, but it wouldn't take long to guess who I'll be getting my tune from. On this forum, the EC tune has received exemplary support from Greg and others at EC as well as highly technical information that is of real benefit to the community. That's support direct from the source. They don't just sell to, but also support the community, which shows a confidence in their product and extends a confidence to the buyer that they'll be well taken care of.
 

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Three great choices, Ram looks beefy, plenty of rebates.
F50, very popular and the Chevy can't say much.

I think you have to look at: needs, budget and reliabilty and test drive it.

Good luck
 

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I have had F-250's and now Ram 1500. Love them both
 

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Solid customer support from Eurocompulsion.
 

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Now, now boys. I'd like to see this discussion continue. No reason it can't stay civil (cough). I take with a grain of salt one company's dyno chart versus another. Even if the numbers aren't fudged we know that different brand dynos give different results. That's why one dyno's 37 hp gain might be better than another's 43 hp gain.

I've spent so much time researching this issue it's ridiculous. Here's where I am right now: I think EC has tremendous customer support and those here who own their products are very happy with that support. I think EC does everything they can to make it right when things don't go well. That's very important to me. I think EC saying an upgraded intercooler makes sense for the bigger power numbers. In fact, GWR and Tork have upgraded FMICs in their cars. For the 124 I'm not sold on the need for intakes at the current power levels. I don't think they hurt, but I don't think they are huge bang for the buck. At least not yet. Maybe when we start seeing +250 HP. It seems the coil packs in this car might be a weak link and I think EC recommends those as a future preventative measure. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here. I'd be willing to run my stock coil packs until they gave me trouble.

I think Tork might be one of the best tuners in the world for this car. I do believe John Bushbaum knows what he's doing when it comes to making power. The Tork Phase 1 with launch control, WOT shifting and strong pull all the way to redline is impressive. Tork will tell you all day long his tune beats EC in the 1/4 mile or a street drag race and we know those things have happened. But a couple of races don't prove who is really the best. We know Eddie's car was fast. But he also had E85 and a bigger turbo. Brett's car from Auto Ricambi is stock with only a Stage 1 tune and it is fast also. If I stopped right here I'd probably choose Tork. But Tork's problem is that John is his own worst enemy. He is very passionate and doesn't take criticism well at all. He launches a lot of attacks on social media which makes him look bad. To be fair, he gets attacked plenty as well. There are also some customers of Tork that came away unhappy after a problem or dispute with John. Those issues are very public on the internet. I think the fact that Tork has partnered with Auto Ricambi is a smart move. We know AR also takes care of their customers so I think Tork is a viable option because of AR.

I wish I could buy them both and see for myself which one I really like. Personally, I don't care if one is a tad bit faster than the other or has a few more ponies. What I do care about is that in 10 years my car will still be running as smoothly as it is today on a stock tune. I will probably be buying one of these tunes very soon but honestly, I still don't know which one.
 

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Now, now boys. I'd like to see this discussion continue. No reason it can't stay civil (cough). I take with a grain of salt one company's dyno chart versus another. Even if the numbers aren't fudged we know that different brand dynos give different results. That's why one dyno's 37 hp gain might be better than another's 43 hp gain.

I've spent so much time researching this issue it's ridiculous. Here's where I am right now: I think EC has tremendous customer support and those here who own their products are very happy with that support. I think EC does everything they can to make it right when things don't go well. That's very important to me. I think EC saying an upgraded intercooler makes sense for the bigger power numbers. In fact, GWR and Tork have upgraded FMICs in their cars. For the 124 I'm not sold on the need for intakes at the current power levels. I don't think they hurt, but I don't think they are huge bang for the buck. At least not yet. Maybe when we start seeing +250 HP. It seems the coil packs in this car might be a weak link and I think EC recommends those as a future preventative measure. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here. I'd be willing to run my stock coil packs until they gave me trouble.

I think Tork might be one of the best tuners in the world for this car. I do believe John Bushbaum knows what he's doing when it comes to making power. The Tork Phase 1 with launch control, WOT shifting and strong pull all the way to redline is impressive. Tork will tell you all day long his tune beats EC in the 1/4 mile or a street drag race and we know those things have happened. But a couple of races don't prove who is really the best. We know Eddie's car was fast. But he also had E85 and a bigger turbo. Brett's car from Auto Ricambi is stock with only a phase 1 tune and it is fast also. If I stopped right here I'd probably choose Tork. But Tork's problem is that John is his own worst enemy. He is very passionate and doesn't take criticism well at all. He launches a lot of attacks on social media which makes him look bad. To be fair, he gets attacked plenty as well. There are also some customers of Tork that came away unhappy after a problem or dispute with John. Those issues are very public on the internet. I think the fact that Tork has partnered with Auto Ricambi is a smart move. We know AR also takes care of their customers so I think Tork is a viable option because of AR.

I wish I could buy them both and see for myself which one I really like. Personally, I don't care if one is a tad bit faster than the other or has a few more ponies. What I do care about is that in 10 years my car will still be running as smoothly as it is today on a stock tune. I will probably be buying one of these tunes very soon but honestly, I still don't know which one.
Nailed it re. John (historically) being his own worst enemy. That said, whoever said the customer is always right clearly never had any customers. God knows I have daily battles with myself trying to stay civil with some of mine.

I went with EC when they were the only flash tune option available. I've had, and continue to have, very good service from them. If I was doing it again, it would be a tough choice between Tork and EC and I haven't heard anyone expressing regret about either choice. But at this point even if you could prove Tork was a bit faster I don't believe the difference is worth forking out another $800 and taking the chance on a company with a (possibly unfair) reputation for patchy support versus one I know from personal experience to be great.
 
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I don't think I ever got the impression that one company focuses more on reliability while one focuses more on performance. In fact, EC's dyno numbers show they're making more power, so while some dynos do read higher on some cars than others, the actual gains over baseline measurements are greater. Granted, all we have is what each manufacturer provided us but not owning either tune and looking at each from the outside, it looks like EC's adds more power. I recall a discussion where AR was asked what boost levels they were running on the Tork tune and they were comparable to stock boost levels at 21psi, so there's that as well. May have been just on their Stage 0 tune.

Not saying it's a bad tune, not saying the power claims are bogus, just saying I've never had the impression that Tork's tunes are more performance oriented than EC's, and brand affiliation (GWR, etc) is merely a correlation.

Edit: I won't speculate as to why some companies choose to use one tune over another. My initial point was, there are reasons that may have nothing to do with performance and we shouldn't make assumptions as to why those decisions were made.
 

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Bottom line I think is you'll have a h#ll of a good time driving either.
Good times...
 

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@XtremeRevolution I agree with you. I think EC's tunes are every bit as performance oriented as Tork's. @Brett67 has told me that Tork caps the boost at 21 psi. That tells me he isn't willing to risk completely everything for the fastest tune. I will say that his pops and gurgles sounds awesomely ridiculous. @sharkcohen has posted a pic of his boost gauge at 27 psi with the EC Phase 2 tune. I have much to learn and perhaps the 1.4 can handle much more boost than stock levels. I'd love to see some examples out there of the multiair pushing big boost and holding up. Where @Christian Peehler and I differ is that I can't afford to replace a blown engine just because I experimented with an $800 tune that was too hot. What I expect from both tuners is that they are toeing the line of performance but being mindful of safety and longevity. Christian wants maximum performance from his engine and is willing to take the risk. I plan on tracking my car also but I'll take 90% performance if the other 10% is too risky. I'll make up the difference in tires, suspension and better driver skills.
 

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. That said, whoever said the customer is always right clearly never had any customers. God knows I have daily battles with myself trying to stay civil with some of mine.
So true. And let's face it, too many Fast and Furious kids out there who have unreasonable expectations from what a tune will do, then add in their own flavor of mods that makes the car unstable and unsafe and then when it goes boom they point the figure back at the tuner when in reality they caused their own issues. I think at least some of what is published about Tork from unsatisfied customers is this very issue. And that goes for equally for people who complain about EC.
 

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So true. And let's face it, too many Fast and Furious kids out there who have unreasonable expectations from what a tune will do, then add in their own flavor of mods that makes the car unstable and unsafe and then when it goes boom they point the figure back at the tuner when in reality they caused their own issues. I think at least some of what is published about Tork from unsatisfied customers is this very issue. And that goes for equally for people who complain about EC.
I see this so often with Subaru's. Kids blame the tuner, but didn't scale for a new intake, or didn't scale the new injectors. I beat on my cars on the track, but do so in a safe manner. I don't run the car too hot, I'm not launching like an idiot at lights etc. I use my cars hard, but have yet to have a major failure. I think misuse is a much more likely cause of failure than anything else for just about every car. That and faulty parts from the factory.
 

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Now, now boys. I'd like to see this discussion continue. No reason it can't stay civil (cough). I take with a grain of salt one company's dyno chart versus another. Even if the numbers aren't fudged we know that different brand dynos give different results. That's why one dyno's 37 hp gain might be better than another's 43 hp gain.

I've spent so much time researching this issue it's ridiculous. Here's where I am right now: I think EC has tremendous customer support and those here who own their products are very happy with that support. I think EC does everything they can to make it right when things don't go well. That's very important to me. I think EC saying an upgraded intercooler makes sense for the bigger power numbers. In fact, GWR and Tork have upgraded FMICs in their cars. For the 124 I'm not sold on the need for intakes at the current power levels. I don't think they hurt, but I don't think they are huge bang for the buck. At least not yet. Maybe when we start seeing +250 HP. It seems the coil packs in this car might be a weak link and I think EC recommends those as a future preventative measure. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here. I'd be willing to run my stock coil packs until they gave me trouble.

I think Tork might be one of the best tuners in the world for this car. I do believe John Bushbaum knows what he's doing when it comes to making power. The Tork Phase 1 with launch control, WOT shifting and strong pull all the way to redline is impressive. Tork will tell you all day long his tune beats EC in the 1/4 mile or a street drag race and we know those things have happened. But a couple of races don't prove who is really the best. We know Eddie's car was fast. But he also had E85 and a bigger turbo. Brett's car from Auto Ricambi is stock with only a phase 1 tune and it is fast also. If I stopped right here I'd probably choose Tork. But Tork's problem is that John is his own worst enemy. He is very passionate and doesn't take criticism well at all. He launches a lot of attacks on social media which makes him look bad. To be fair, he gets attacked plenty as well. There are also some customers of Tork that came away unhappy after a problem or dispute with John. Those issues are very public on the internet. I think the fact that Tork has partnered with Auto Ricambi is a smart move. We know AR also takes care of their customers so I think Tork is a viable option because of AR.

I wish I could buy them both and see for myself which one I really like. Personally, I don't care if one is a tad bit faster than the other or has a few more ponies. What I do care about is that in 10 years my car will still be running as smoothly as it is today on a stock tune. I will probably be buying one of these tunes very soon but honestly, I still don't know which one.
This is so dead on accurate.

I see most of the racers using Tork/Auto Ricambi tunes right now, which is why I went with them. I think John has an abrasive personality, which I don't really care about. I want the best tune possible, I don't care who does it.

The good news is, since all of the products are sold through Auto Ricambi, I deal with Brett, and his customer service has always been top notch. So I don't have to deal with John, and I get the tune, which I believe may be a bit more on the aggressive side. For those of you that want the easy button power that's safe, maybe Euro Drive is for you. I haven't tested it, so I will not comment on the quality. I do know they had hesitation issues on Phase 2 which made me nervous, but Greg did his best to fix all issues and work with the clients.

So despite there being some minor issues, I have no doubt they'll address the issues in a timely manner.

For my needs, I went with the Tork Handheld because I felt it was a better bang for my buck, it's slightly cheaper, and the mods to get to Stage 1+ (probably similar power levels to Phase 2)

The dyno on the Tork 1+ tune shows 247.29wtq and 198.83whp, so I think maybe top end isn't as strong because it has no intake, and the stock turbo runs out of breath, but the bottom end seems like it has a TON of grunt to it.


Either way, you'll have a smoother and faster car. So you cannot go wrong. I personally think for the racers, Tork may have more aggressive tunes. Maybe they're not as safe, but I personally am willing to push the envelope for more power. We have a 1.4L engine, if it pops I'll replace it, it's not that expensive (not that their tunes will blow the motor up... I just personally care more for performance, and I think Tork may have a slight edge in this department, it seems like EC is pushing for easy safe power, and great customer service, while AR/Tork are looking to get the edge on performance).

Two different schools of thought, and I fit in on the performance side of things.




I can’t agree with EC being the slower more conservative tune and All I do is race the car . I tracked phase 1 with no Intercooler and no intake and the car was a force out there passing all sorts of much faster, track prepped cars . Now I’m tracking with phase 2 and my low end power is perfect and top end pulls very hard . I raced my pops Miata ND which is stock & it beat me when I was stock, now my car ran so far away from it looked like he wasn’t trying , so phase 1 & 2 Are both plenty fast .

Here is a driver of an S2000 I ran with commenting about my car being stupid fast after he had the chance to run with me in the same run group on a faster track with plenty long straights getting me into 5th gear .

Any way I love that more people are getting into tracking their cars , and hopefully we all get out together , race them and have fun VS chopping speculations up on the forum .

If anyone is interested in a ride along to experience EC phase 2 on the track id be more then happy to arrange as I’m out there monthly for my therapy sessions ?

EC has and retains my vote for all my tuning needs due to unmatched customer service & a **** of a fast product.
 

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Does the EC tune feature the 2 maps changeable with the Abarth's Sport button?

Since I'd be getting the V4 from EC, it would make sense to also get the tune from them.
 

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Does the EC tune feature the 2 maps changeable with the Abarth's Sport button?

Since I'd be getting the V4 from EC, it would make sense to also get the tune from them.
Yes, you can have two different tunes in non-sport and sport mode.
 

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@XtremeRevolution I agree with you. I think EC's tunes are every bit as performance oriented as Tork's. @Brett67 has told me that Tork caps the boost at 21 psi. That tells me he isn't willing to risk completely everything for the fastest tune. I will say that his pops and gurgles sounds awesomely ridiculous. @sharkcohen has posted a pic of his boost gauge at 27 psi with the EC Phase 2 tune. I have much to learn and perhaps the 1.4 can handle much more boost than stock levels. I'd love to see some examples out there of the multiair pushing big boost and holding up. Where @Christian Peehler and I differ is that I can't afford to replace a blown engine just because I experimented with an $800 tune that was too hot. What I expect from both tuners is that they are toeing the line of performance but being mindful of safety and longevity. Christian wants maximum performance from his engine and is willing to take the risk. I plan on tracking my car also but I'll take 90% performance if the other 10% is too risky. I'll make up the difference in tires, suspension and better driver skills.
Here it is again because it is very fun to post.

 

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